I have frozen the code and built the NeoOffice 2.0 Alpha PowerPC binaries. More importantly, I have confirmed that I have adequate bandwidth to support an "early access" program. So I thought that I'd let everyone one know the details of the release. Here are the dates that this binary will be available:
25 April 2006 - NeoOffice 2.0 Alpha PowerPC early access program opens and, for US$25, you can download the binary for personal use only.
09 May 2006 - The price for the NeoOffice 2.0 Alpha PowerPC early access program drops to US$10 and the "for personal use only" restriction is still in effect.
23 May 2006 - The NeoOffice 2.0 Alpha PowerPC early access program ends and downloads are available for free from our mirrors and the "for personal use only" restriction is lifted.
I will be working on the planamesa.com website all this week in order to prepare for the start of early access next week. Expect to see a small advertisement for the upcoming early access program on the NeoOffice download page sometime on Wednesday of this week.
While I know this program is not popular with some of you, please spread the word as this program needs to be successful to ensure that we can fund releases later this year for the Intel platform and Ed's Aqua widgets.
Joined: Oct 03, 2005 Posts: 8 Location: Taranto, Italy
Posted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 6:21 am Post subject:
There will be any "special offer" for those people that have already donated?
I'm a college student and I've not enough money to do two donations in a month, but I would want to contribute to the development of NeoOffice. _________________ Apple MacBook C2D 2.2 GHz White - 2 Gb RAM - HD 120 Gb - SuperDrive 8x DL *** iPod touch 16 Gb *** Time Capsule 500GB
Posted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 7:08 am Post subject: Re: NeoOffice 2.0 Alpha PowerPC Release Details
Congratulations Patrick! I look forward to the 26th. I have a couple of questions, though:
Is there an estimated time-frame for the upcoming Intel Alpha? I now have a Mini at work and am quite looking forward to running NeoOffice on it. While I appreciate the OOo OSX X11 efforts, NeoOffice is a far nicer user experience. I hadn't used the X11 OOo in a while, one quickly forgets exactly how much work has gone into NeoOffice. Yes OOo X11 works but all of the niceties are missing... I, for one, would quite happily sacrifice stability for further integration. (At least temporarily.)
Also, what is meant by personal use? It is, after all, GPL code. I would have thought that restrictions on use wouldn't be allowed. (This isn't to suggest any problem with charging for access to the binaries, just on then restricting use.)
Ben
pluby wrote:
I have frozen the code and built the NeoOffice 2.0 Alpha PowerPC binaries. More importantly, I have confirmed that I have adequate bandwidth to support an "early access" program. So I thought that I'd let everyone one know the details of the release. Here are the dates that this binary will be available:
25 April 2006 - NeoOffice 2.0 Alpha PowerPC early access program opens and, for US$25, you can download the binary for personal use only.
<snip>
I will be working on the planamesa.com website all this week in order to prepare for the start of early access next week. Expect to see a small advertisement for the upcoming early access program on the NeoOffice download page sometime on Wednesday of this week.
While I know this program is not popular with some of you, please spread the word as this program needs to be successful to ensure that we can fund releases later this year for the Intel platform and Ed's Aqua widgets.
Posted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 8:30 am Post subject: Re: NeoOffice 2.0 Alpha PowerPC Release Details
ben wrote:
Also, what is meant by personal use? It is, after all, GPL code. I would have thought that restrictions on use wouldn't be allowed. (This isn't to suggest any problem with charging for access to the binaries, just on then restricting use.)
Look at the NeoOffice trademark usage guidelines here:
There is a common misconception that GPL makes everything zero cost. That was never the intent of the authors of the GPL who ue the phrase '"free'' as in "free speech,'' not as in "free beer.'''
With the GPL, you get the right to use, modify, and redistribute the source code, not trademarks. As the trademark usage guidelines state, you are free to excise the NeoOffice wordmark from the code, recompile, and redistribute your non-NeoOffice branded build. The GPL, however, does not give you any license to the NeoOffice trademark so we can restrict distribution or use of the trademark how ever we see fit. Since the binaries have our trademark, the trademark becomes the more restrictive issue, not the GPL.
Posted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 8:37 am Post subject: Re: NeoOffice 2.0 Alpha PowerPC Release Details
ben wrote:
Is there an estimated time-frame for the upcoming Intel Alpha? I now have a Mini at work and am quite looking forward to running NeoOffice on it. While I appreciate the OOo OSX X11 efforts, NeoOffice is a far nicer user experience. I hadn't used the X11 OOo in a while, one quickly forgets exactly how much work has gone into NeoOffice. Yes OOo X11 works but all of the niceties are missing... I, for one, would quite happily sacrifice stability for further integration. (At least temporarily.)
Release of an Intel version will largely depend on whether or not our early access program actually brings in revenues. As I said in the other thread, the reason that I am starting the early access program is because we are receiving only enough donations to keep NeoOffice on life-support, not to add support for a whole new platform. If we find that only a few people sign up for the early access program, I may seriously consider dropping further releases.
There will be any "special offer" for those people that have already donated?
I'm a college student and I've not enough money to do two donations in a month, but I would want to contribute to the development of NeoOffice.
Sorry, but no. Since running NeoOffice is a money-losing operation, donations are used up immediately in order to keep our download servers up and this forum up, and me troubleshooting and fixing existing bugs. I funded the Neo 2.0 Alpha development from my own investment and a single large donation that I got in 2005 so I need to earn my investment back from the users who are dying to get this early.
For those who don't want or cannot pay more, NeoOffice 2.0 Alpha PowerPC will be available for free download on 23 May 2006. Also, OOo 2.0.2 X11 has been available for free download for quite some time now.
Could you clarify what you mean precisely? For example, if I pay for a personal use license, may I edit documents which are own/controlled by my employer?
I'd hope that the answer is yes, that your only intention is to disallow redistribution of neoffice itself ... but my definition of "personal" and yours may vary ;>
Could you clarify what you mean precisely? For example, if I pay for a personal use license, may I edit documents which are own/controlled by my employer?
I'd hope that the answer is yes, that your only intention is to disallow redistribution of neoffice itself ... but my definition of "personal" and yours may vary ;>
"Personal use" will only apply to redistribution of the NeoOffice binary. Your documents are copyrighted by whomever created them, not me and even if you edit them in NeoOffice or MS Office or anyboby else's software, you still own the copyright.
The key here is that people cannot make one early access program and copy the NeoOffice binary to everyone in their organization. My attitude is that large organizations are in the best position to fund NeoOffice and for them to be able to pay only one license to support their 100, 1000, or 10,000 employees seems blatantly unfair to the single user or small businesses that use NeoOffice.
I have actually put in logging of domain names that install NeoOffice 2.0 Alpha so that I can quickly identify any large organizations that might violate the no redistribution restriction. I borrowed this idea from Netscape. Back in the day, Netscape was free for personal, educational, and non-profit use but cost something like US$30 for commercial use. Not surprisingly, hoards of people from corporations large and small downloaded and redistributed Netscape to their employees. Netscape would then send a big bill to obvious violators when they found some organizations installing hundreds or thousands of copies without paying the commercial license fee.
Could you clarify what you mean precisely? For example, if I pay for a personal use license, may I edit documents which are own/controlled by my employer?
I'd hope that the answer is yes, that your only intention is to disallow redistribution of neoffice itself ... but my definition of "personal" and yours may vary ;>
The key here is that people cannot make one early access program and copy the NeoOffice binary to everyone in their organization. My attitude is that large organizations are in the best position to fund NeoOffice and for them to be able to pay only one license to support their 100, 1000, or 10,000 employees seems blatantly unfair to the single user or small businesses that use NeoOffice.
And since you do 'sell' site licenses, this falls under Sarbanes-Oxley (and if you don't know what this is, it is a nightmare for most companies right now.) Thus, you can state that a support license is available and costs X dollars per seat (this is what Microsoft is moving back to vice unlimited site licenses.) So, this means that you can state that a company can use 150 'seats' that is one copy per functioning system up to 150 systems and this cannot be varied. If they move to 200 systems, they either have to:
1. Purchase 50 more seats.
2. Not install your software on 50 systems.
3. Re-license for a server system that will insure that no more than 150 copies are in use at one given time.
No variations are allowed or they get hit wih a very stiff Federal fine. This also covers in-house software development and implementation. No one can produce, design, procure any software that bypasses licensing agreements. Even if the software allows for such 'additional' usage, it is now illegal in the United States. And, yes, I have to deal with SOX and its after effects.
pluby wrote:
I have actually put in logging of domain names that install NeoOffice 2.0 Alpha so that I can quickly identify any large organizations that might violate the no redistribution restriction. I borrowed this idea from Netscape. Back in the day, Netscape was free for personal, educational, and non-profit use but cost something like US$30 for commercial use. Not surprisingly, hoards of people from corporations large and small downloaded and redistributed Netscape to their employees. Netscape would then send a big bill to obvious violators when they found some organizations installing hundreds or thousands of copies without paying the commercial license fee.
And it is a good idea to advise them that failure to comply with SOX can result in undesired conseqences.
pluby wrote:
Hope that clears it up.
Like the streams and creeks that flow through Eastern Pennsylvania. If you don't know, there is NOTHING growing in those waters. They are crystal clear and you can count the rocks on the bottom on most days.
I hope that my point about SOX is crystal clear. Violate Patrick and Eds licensing agreement and you are a small, medium or large corporation and you are now in trouble with the U.S. Government. I've seen the outcome of some SOX/SPA audits and it is not pretty. It would be much better to support them than have your monies go to more enforcement actions. And for private folks, if you also violate the rules and your 'friends' find out they could come out $50K richer...
Joined: May 25, 2003 Posts: 4752 Location: Santa Barbara, CA
Posted: Tue Apr 18, 2006 10:41 pm Post subject:
Don't forget, too, that you can always download and build the source code. The only thing is that you can't redistribute/resell it and still call it NeoOffice with the trademark restrictions, but that doesn't mean you can't just strip the name and graphics and go for it. It's a branding thing
When it comes down to it, though, the ultimate goal is to find a way Patrick can keep affording to work on it full-time and solidify all of the changes for the new underlying OOo and new platform.
Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2006 9:10 am Post subject: Trademark doesn't trump copyright
I want this project to succeed, but trying to end-run around the license is not a good idea.
The FSF guys have been very clear about what happens when there's a conflict between the (L)GPL and any other restrictions. If you can't redistribute under the (L)GPL terms, then you can't redistribute at all, because nothing else gives you those rights.
Of course I'm not a lawyer, but treading into potential copyright violation territory doesn't seem like a good way to win support from the OOo community.
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