No offense rays, but maybe the problematic version should be a "freebie". If I end up borking my system, I'd rather not have paid $25 smackers for the privilege first...
So go buy a copy of Tiger already and then you can use the latest and greatest software.
He can probably grab 10.3 for $25 at this point and download the free version(s) of Neo and still come out ahead.
Smokey _________________ "[...] whether the duck drinks hot chocolate or coffee is irrelevant." -- ovvldc and sardisson in the NeoWiki
Well, I was all set to get a MacBook with Tiger goodness but didn't get the replacement job I was seeking, so watching my finances right now just in case my current situation doesn't work out...
Well, I was all set to get a MacBook with Tiger goodness but didn't get the replacement job I was seeking, so watching my finances right now just in case my current situation doesn't work out...
Well, if you can't keep your Mac up to date, I hope you aren't applying for IT positions.
Joined: Nov 21, 2005 Posts: 1285 Location: Witless Protection Program
Posted: Tue Aug 15, 2006 10:35 pm Post subject:
MacRat wrote:
Guest wrote:
Well, I was all set to get a MacBook with Tiger goodness but didn't get the replacement job I was seeking, so watching my finances right now just in case my current situation doesn't work out...
Well, if you can't keep your Mac up to date, I hope you aren't applying for IT positions.
Bad MacRat B a d - grin
Kicking a poor guy when he doesn't have the funds to buy a NEW MacBook.
That's just ... not nice!
Guest - I feel your pain - I have been in unknown finances situation before. Even worse when it delays purchasing of a new MacBook. I'm saving my pennies for a new Mac - maybe by the end of the year.
Sorry that there is no ... zero cost to upgrade to the newer NeoOffice.
Getting an old version of 10.3, for ~$25 may be your best bet.
Philip ( trying NOT to hold his breath until he can afford a new Intel Mac! )
No offense rays, but maybe the problematic version should be a "freebie". If I end up borking my system, I'd rather not have paid $25 smackers for the privilege first...
Well, there's costs involved at Rays' end, and you'll be donating to NeoOffice development as well . I understand your feeling, but you can't scrape off everything. Either take the risk or do not..
However, the suggestion to invest $25 in Panther is a very good one and more likely to make you a happy mac user.
Best wishes,
Oscar _________________ "What do you think of Western Civilization?"
"I think it would be a good idea!"
- Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi
Joined: May 25, 2003 Posts: 4752 Location: Santa Barbara, CA
Posted: Tue Aug 15, 2006 11:10 pm Post subject:
Seriously though, man, if you're that hard-strapped for cash that you can't either afford hardware supported by XPostFacto you may want to consider evaluating your options. Even MS Office v.X has had flaws on those OSes.
If I were in your position, knowing how many security patches have been issued by Apple for both 10.3 and 10.4 and *not* 10.2, I'd strongly consider updating to an OS for which Apple is patching security holes. If you can't, lock down everything you can and unplug your network cable otherwise you may find someone unknown person drinking away your bank account.
While part of me criticizes Apple for not patching security flaws in 10.2, most of me finds it understandable; it really isn't their responsibility to provide updates forever. After all, not even GM provides cheap parts available OEM for a late 60's Corvette.
Even Microsoft acknowledges that there are security flaws in Win95 and Win98 that MS wlll never patch. Even Adobe has discontinued support for OS 9 applications. Even Ford has uncovered gas tank flaws in unserviced Pintos that will also never be fixed.
Panther's release was nearly 3 years ago. I'm sorry that you can't afford newer operating systems or the hardware to run them, but we can't support something forever that's due to circumstances beyond our control.
Well, I was all set to get a MacBook with Tiger goodness but didn't get the replacement job I was seeking, so watching my finances right now just in case my current situation doesn't work out...
Well, if you can't keep your Mac up to date, I hope you aren't applying for IT positions.
Well, actually I was but since I'm not IT certified, I went back to civil engineering, which I'm degree'd in. Off to a rocky start csince it's been so long since I actually had to design stuff, hope to work my way back in before I get canned or have aheart attack... I am fairly confident in my self-taught IT skills, however. For me, Jag does what I need it to do, for now, when I eventually get that new Mac, I'll get the recent OS. On the PC side, still using Windows Me and my son uses XP, both free gifts. I only "pay" for Macs
Joined: Aug 27, 2006 Posts: 2 Location: Halfway, Oregon
Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 3:06 pm Post subject: NeoOffice for Mac 10.2
It is interesting to see this concept of desupporting older versions. I feel you are completely on the wrong track. I feel a Open Source project should provide all older versions since there is little or no cost.
One of the reasons I have stayed with Mac (now Linux too) for all these years is that. I hate applications that have upgraded and added many things I don't need. (FireFox really got this right with plugins) I for one always use the earliest version with what I need. With that concept I use less space and the applications almost alway run faster. I store all my database diagrams on MacDraw 1.9.6 I can store hundreds of them and have very minimal space usasge.
In some cases if new versions offer somthing I need I may upgrade but in most cases I will avoide it.
I recently had my Mac ibook die and got another. I forgot to save the install for 1.2.1 on my Linux server. I would like to get one from somebody if they have it. Not really interested in upgrading either OS or other NewOffice versions unless I need to usually no benifit except to IT sellers. I also find the longer Oo works the more obnoxious M$ like featrues we are stuck with.
I hate M$ word and have never used it. The application is completely inefficient. I probably will use Oo at work as we are working on moving all our documents to OpenDoc soon but really don't want to put up with it on my personal stuff.
Joined: May 25, 2003 Posts: 4752 Location: Santa Barbara, CA
Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 3:43 pm Post subject: Re: NeoOffice for Mac 10.2
taildragerdriver wrote:
It is interesting to see this concept of desupporting older versions. I feel you are completely on the wrong track. I feel a Open Source project should provide all older versions since there is little or no cost.
Before I answer, I do see your point and I myself frequently stay on older versions too as long as I can. I stayed on Photoshop 3 for years myself
Unfortunately, the "little or no cost" for maintaining previous versions isn't completely accurate. Just because something is released doesn't mean that it's finished and set in stone. They still have bugs, sometimes fatal ones (like the old 1.x installers) that take actual developers time to fix and QA. New operating system releases may break old code, and fixes available on newer operating systems may not be able to be backported to older operating system versions.
The primary factors that cause discontinuation of software in the commercial space are no different in open source: high maintenance cost and limited resources.
If no one offers you Neo/J 1.2, I have 1.1, non-system-hosing English version but you'll have to provide me with somewhere to upload it to, I don't do emails...
If no one offers you Neo/J 1.2, I have 1.1, non-system-hosing English version but you'll have to provide me with somewhere to upload it to, I don't do emails...
That's actually incorrect. There was only one Neo/J 1.1 installer and if you have your System Preferences to a certain (but not entirely known) language, your disk will get horked. Apple's installer misencodes the UTF-8 paths in our installer settings files and, since the result is gibberish, the Mac OS X installer uses / by default.
Posted: Mon Aug 28, 2006 1:39 am Post subject: Re: NeoOffice for Mac 10.2
taildragerdriver wrote:
I forgot to save the install for 1.2.1 on my Linux server. I would like to get one from somebody if they have it. Not really interested in upgrading either OS or other NewOffice versions unless I need to usually no benifit except to IT sellers. I also find the longer Oo works the more obnoxious M$ like featrues we are stuck with.
Joined: Aug 27, 2006 Posts: 2 Location: Halfway, Oregon
Posted: Mon Aug 28, 2006 4:19 am Post subject: Limiting concepts seem a problem
As a developer myself although not in the public arena, I have a very different situation.I am a project leader for a governement Environmental Analysis program on AIX unix. First we deliver a version which is supported in a specific environment. It can't be changed after delivery we must deliver a new version if we need to fix a bug. We also must maintain all the old versions because each analysis is done in a specific version and all the data and results are stored in an archived file after an analysis is complete. If the results are taken to court 5 to 10 years later we need to reserect the version and demonstrate in some cases exacly how the issues were addressed with the software with the original source data and the exact version of analysis tools.
So I see a very different concept in play here.
It seems to me there is a middle ground. First it seems unlikely to me that space of storing a earlier version is a real major issue. It seems to me that if it were made available on only one or a few download sites, which makes sense since the downloads would be minimal, space would be less impacted than the current version sites.
It also seems to me that there is a missing concept here in the reply that inicates a need to manitain and upgrade an older version. When an older version is made available it could be left in the original state with documentation of the environment in which it works correcly. So for example NeoOffice 1.2.1 for Mac OS 10.2.8 or earlier. There should be some documentation of issues of use with later OS version but let the user be responsible for appropriate use of the software.
The above concept seems like a good and reasonable way to serve every need and not limit the availability earlier version.
I personally have many older versions of Mac software I maintain by OS version on my Linux file server. The reason I do this is because of the quality of old Mac hardware. I use it in the shop for maintianing Vehicle and Tractor parts listings and maintanance records in pretty bad environments. I have serveral of these 20 plus year old Mac's that still work great. It is easy as a user to understand and it seems to me the developer serves the user community best by making all the versions avialable.
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B a d - grin
I'm saving my pennies for a new Mac - maybe by the end of the year. 
. I understand your feeling, but you can't scrape off everything. Either take the risk or do not..
