Posted: Sat Nov 27, 2004 7:13 pm Post subject: Neooffice vs. OpenOffice 2.0 vs. Neooffice/J
Hello,
as far as i understooth, there will be no OOo 2.0 Mac OS X native port, just X11 version and N/J port, am i right with this?
I just would like to ask, what happend? It's because lack of active developers, and Sun is not able/want to help with this? Will you resume your Neooffice activity, or you will stay with Java "wraper"? Can please some or our developers put a short info about this? Or if i didn't found existing comment about this, please, send me to right place in forum
Anyway, thanks for you app - with Cocoa menu bar is quite fun to use it, and now, when we found, that we can use complete localization from OOo, including spellcheckers and help, we have first usable Mac OS X office suite in czech language (nop, i don't think that X11 version is usable for average Mac users I'm looking forward to see more "macifaing", even if app will be not Aquafied soon - but nailing some behaviour problems, like "closing of empty windows quits app" will be nice too
So, i'll just wait, when PayPal will be available in Czech, so i can donate somethink too.
Thanks, as far as i'm following Neooffice from the start two years ago, i'm aware of this My question was about future and about OOo 2.0 - there is no official support for native Mac OS X version in OOo 2.0 plans, as far as i read different marketing and development documents, for example
http://marketing.openoffice.org/2.0/featureguide.html
I know that there is lack of developers, so i just want to know if there are still some official plans, or if native OS X version was simple left in dusk, because of lack of resources.
- but nailing some behaviour problems, like "closing of empty windows quits app" will be nice too
MaLer, get your NeoOffice/J users used to closing windows with the keyboard cmd-w instead of clicking the 'close window' icon - when you close the last open doc with cmd-w, Neo/J will still stay running... skvostný !
- but nailing some behaviour problems, like "closing of empty windows quits app" will be nice too
MaLer, get your NeoOffice/J users used to closing windows with the keyboard cmd-w instead of clicking the 'close window' icon - when you close the last open doc with cmd-w, Neo/J will still stay running... skvostný !
- yoxi
Good idea, but i belive, that it will be able to make more in "Mac OS X" way. That's why i suggest Neooffice and not OOo/X11 - because it's beter Mac OS X app. And i belive, that you understand that less exceptions you must remember, then more you can concentrate on work itself? Nemam pravdu?
So if there will be some pool about future features, i'll vote for this one Best of course can be, if there will be no window at all, if there will be no open document.
less exceptions you must remember, then more you can concentrate on work itself?
Oh, I agree - I've already suggested earlier on in this forum somewhere the same thing: to have an optional 'Do you really want to quit?' message, but meanwhile, I've found it doesn't take long to learn cmd-w just for Neo/J, and it saves frustration.
And I personally dislike the OSX tendency to quit apps when the last doc window is closed. It makes sense for apps that only have one dialog window, but not for word processors and suchlike. Just because it's OSX doesn't mean it's the best way to do things... neslušný návrh?
So if there will be some pool about future features, i'll vote for this one Best of course can be, if there will be no window at all, if there will be no open document.
Add that to the constantly growing list of new features that everyone wants...
Seriously, I hate repeating myself but I will do it again since MaLer is a new poster and may not have much understanding of how the Neo/J project works. Neo/J is developed by me and Ed. That's it. We work unpaid in our spare time. We are not some big corporation that makes money selling this thing so we have to go earn money elsewhere so that we can afford to do Neo/J.
Ideas are great and they are the easy part. Programming those ideas takes far more time. As a result, I generally ignore these feature request discussions because I am already spending every waking hour fixing existing OOo, Java, and Mac OS X. After that, I have to figure out how to upgrade to the newer OOo and Java versions next year. That pretty much leaves no room for new features.
The common complaint that I hear is "but this bug fix or feature will save me or my users lots of time". If this is the case, you should think about funding that feature.
So if there will be some pool about future features, i'll vote for this one Best of course can be, if there will be no window at all, if there will be no open document.
Add that to the constantly growing list of new features that everyone wants...
Seriously, I hate repeating myself but I will do it again since MaLer is a new poster and may not have much understanding of how the Neo/J project works. Neo/J is developed by me and Ed. That's it. We work unpaid in our spare time. We are not some big corporation that makes money selling this thing so we have to go earn money elsewhere so that we can afford to do Neo/J.
Patrick, let me make one thing clear: i know everythink what you wrote. I'm lurking at neooffice web realy for two years, from first version of Neooffice. I DON'T demand any feature, everything what i can do, is just a make a submision of idea. I understand your situation and i appreciate your work. Belive me, that i'll invest time and my knowledge (which is somehow limited, because i'm not programer) to make very good support for czech version of Neooffice, so more of users can benefit from your work, and then more will be able to make some donation for support of development. And because there is no viable solution for czech, i belive, that my investment of time will pay - there will be happy users and i hope that happy developer too.
Everything what i did, i made a few suggestions how to improve Neooffice, part of which you accepted, part of which not, that's the life. Here i just asked about future development - seems then, that less optimistic version is in place (no native OOo 2, but Neo/J 2). I'll try to take a look on instaler and patch script, maybe i can help at least here somehow.
Sorry to say it so, but you react very negative to every mention of new features. I understand your situation, but seems to me now, that's little bit "over your head" now - i must say, that for a active newbie in community, which would like to help at least as he can (testing, bugreporting, sugestions), it's quite frustrating. I have similar experiences from other projects, for example Camino is nice one - development nearly stalled for year, and Pink was not able even to comunicate about projects future, he took everything too personaly, as a attack on himself. I'm happy user of Safari now, end of story. From my personal point of view, i really don't need Neo/J. I'm complety satisfied with MS Office. What i want, is to help other peoples - local users, and because of this to developers of Neo too. So please try to take my "overactivity" as a sign of villing to help, not to demand anything. I have maybe few ideas, how i can help personaly (translating of info pages to czech, i'll try to setup some mirror on fast line, i'll try to take a look on those installer scripts).
Regarding features request - is there any voting with prices for features? I didn't find it.
So, again - sorry, if my activity somehow is not welcome, i really don't need to do it, just say so. If i can help, i'll try to do it.
I have similar experiences from other projects, for example Camino is nice one - development nearly stalled for year, and Pink was not able even to comunicate about projects future, he took everything too personaly, as a attack on himself. I'm happy user of Safari now, end of story. From my personal point of view, i really don't need Neo/J.
Ah, you know your open source project has hit the big-time when users start making vague threats to use the closed, propriatary, expensive alternatives instead.
Ah, you know your open source project has hit the big-time when users start making vague threats to use the closed, propriatary, expensive alternatives instead.
I use whatever can meet my demands. Some apps are open source, some are commercial - it really doesn't matter for me. I use Safari, because it's for my needs better browser than Camino or Firefox.
And btw, what you mean closed, proprietary, expensive alternative exactly? If i would like, i can write my very own browser on KHTML (Web kit) core...
I appears to me that the postings are starting to drift way off of the topic. Could you please take this off-line or start a new topic in the "Random Whatnot" forum.
For what it's worth, Camino dev didn't stop because I "took things too personally", it stopped because I was working and teaching and we didn't have many other developers willing to pitch in. We don't get paid to do this stuff, you know.
Once we figured out a scheme that got the ball rolling, we haven't looked back. 0.8 kicked serious butt as will 0.9.
Sorry to add to the random whatnot....*shrug*
-Pink (yes, it really is me, IM me and check and I'll confirm it)
Once we figured out a scheme that got the ball rolling, we haven't looked back. 0.8 kicked serious butt as will 0.9.
Sorry to add to the random whatnot....*shrug*
-Pink (yes, it really is me, IM me and check and I'll confirm it)
Wow, more presence of greatness here. Next thing, we'll find out that Steve Jobs frequents this forum too.. Actually, I am really looking forward to Camino 0.9.
But I have one request and I don't know if you heard this through other means: please include the option to downgrade cookies to session cookies.
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