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NeoOffice :: View topic - Dynamically Updated File Names?
Dynamically Updated File Names?
 
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mds
Operator


Joined: Sep 25, 2009
Posts: 43
Location: Switzerland

PostPosted: Wed Dec 30, 2009 7:20 pm    Post subject: Dynamically Updated File Names? Reply with quote

Many native Mac applications dynamically update the name of the file being edited, e.g. Mac OS X' TextEdit.

Do you see any chance to implement this feature in NeoOffice?

Example:

1. Create a file named example.doc (Word document).
2. Open document in TextEdit.
3. Rename file to example2.doc --> TextEdit shows the new file name.

Caveat:

Apple Pages, Microsoft Word and OpenOffice.org apparently do not support dynamically updated file names.

Martin
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pluby
The Architect
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Joined: Jun 16, 2003
Posts: 11857
Location: California, USA

PostPosted: Wed Dec 30, 2009 8:04 pm    Post subject: Re: Dynamically Updated File Names? Reply with quote

This sounds like a new feature in Mac OS X 10.6 Snow Leopard as TextEdit definitely does not have this feature in Mac OS X 10.4.11.

Are you running Snow Leopard? If so, are there any other applications that support this feature? I ask because historically Apple puts new experimental Mac OS X features in TextEdit. Since Pages and Office, like NeoOffice, support pre-Mac OS X 10.6 versions, that feature may require functions that do not exist prior to Mac OS X 10.6.

Patrick
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mds
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Joined: Sep 25, 2009
Posts: 43
Location: Switzerland

PostPosted: Wed Dec 30, 2009 8:21 pm    Post subject: Re: Dynamically Updated File Names? Reply with quote

pluby wrote:
Are you running Snow Leopard?


Yes, Mac OS X 10.6.2.

pluby wrote:
If so, are there any other applications that support this feature?


Yes, for example Preview (included in Mac OS X) and Pixelmator. In most applications, however, this feature is not available (yet?).

Martin
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sardisson
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Joined: Feb 01, 2004
Posts: 4588

PostPosted: Wed Dec 30, 2009 8:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

On 10.5, I have to switch back to TextEdit for the change to happen (but in Bare Bones Software's TextWrangler, it changes as soon as I end editing of the filename in the Finder).

The method that TextWrangler uses exists as far back as 10.3 (though there the change is not instant; I have to switch back to TextWrangler before it happens, just like TextEdit on 10.5). Like on 10.4, TextEdit on 10.3 does not seem to do pick up the change, but I had thought the feature had been part of Cocoa for quite some time.

Can the OOo code deal with files being renamed out from under it? That seems like the sort of sane, modern, useful functionality it would absolutely choke on Razz

Smokey

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mds
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Joined: Sep 25, 2009
Posts: 43
Location: Switzerland

PostPosted: Wed Dec 30, 2009 8:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sardisson wrote:
Can the OOo code deal with files being renamed out from under it?


The current version of OOo requires another save of the file in use, i.e. if you rename a file while being edited with OOo, you will end with two files.

Martin
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pluby
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Joined: Jun 16, 2003
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 30, 2009 9:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Smokey's post gave me an idea of how to test if this is even feasible in NeoOffice's underlying OpenOffice.org code. The bad news is that implementing this feature in the OpenOffice.org code appears to require changes throughout the entire OpenOffice.org code.

The reason is that OpenOffice.org code is path based, not file handle based. From what I can see, TextEdit opens a handle to a file and then does all saving and file name querying on that handle. In contrast, the OpenOffice.org code is path based and when saving or querying a file, the OpenOffice.org code will check the path that was originally opened. From the OpenOffice.org code's perspective, renaming a file is no different than deleting the file or moving the file to another folder. So, the OpenOffice.org code handles this situation by creating a new file with the original name when saving.

Since making OpenOffice.org use file handles like TextEdit instead of path appears to be a large project and we have only one full-time engineer (me) that could work on this, I am willing to look at what is needed to implement this feature but only if there is support for this feature from a large number of NeoOffice donors as this feature would very likely squeeze out any available time for other new features and/or OpenOffice.org upgrades.

If a few dozen NeoOffice donors post their support for this feature, then I can outline the next steps that we will do. And if very few donors post, then I will devote my engineering time to any of the other new feature requests that have the support of a large number of donors.

Patrick
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pluby
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 05, 2010 2:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

FYI. I have moved this topic into our new NeoOffice New Feature Requests forum. If we see a few dozen donors post that they also want this feature, then we will start looking at how to implement this feature.

Patrick
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ovvldc
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Joined: Sep 13, 2004
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 05, 2010 2:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It is not something I miss badly, but it would be nice. And replacing the file code may improve other things. I recall lots of problems with it anyway.

Perhaps something for NeoOffice 3.2?

Best wishes,
Oscar

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djpimley
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(earlier version)


Joined: Jun 11, 2006
Posts: 481
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 06, 2010 10:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If it can be done cleanly, it would be a good technical improvement, so I support it - as long as nothing more vital or interesting comes along. Smile
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pluby
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 4:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Since several donors posted so quickly that they would like to see this feature, I guessed that we might reach the necessary few dozen donor posts very soon so I started investigating how to implement this feature.

The good news is that I found that the existing OpenOffice.org code has some functions that I has able to make use of to implement this feature which any radical changes to NeoOffice's underlying OpenOffice.org code.

Because the feature was much easier to implement than I expected and we already had several donors requesting the feature, I went ahead and implemented it in the following test patch.

Can any donors using the NeoOffice 3.0.2 Early Access release install the test patch and move or rename some files while they are open? After you move or rename a file, the name in the window titlebar should be updated and when you save the file, it will save in the new file location:

Intel:
http://joe.neooffice.org/test/NeoOffice-3.0.2_Early_Access-Patch-0-Test-2-Intel.dmg

PowerPC:
http://joe.neooffice.org/test/NeoOffice-3.0.2_Early_Access-Patch-0-Test-2-PowerPC.dmg

Note: this new feature only works when you move the file within the same volume. In Mac OS X, moving a file to a different volume is really a "copy to new file, delete old file" operation and in these cases there is no way to track where Mac OS X moved the file to.

Patrick
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ovvldc
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Joined: Sep 13, 2004
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 4:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Typical Very Happy.

Thanks and best wishes,
Oscar

P.S. I have never seen the board this quiet since an early access release. Everyone must be satisfied Smile.

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sardisson
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 5:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Either I've misunderstood how this is supposed to work, or the patch isn't working for me Sad

3.0.2 EA with patch above, 10.5.8 Intel

1) I opened an existing file, "Tires.ods", that I have on my Desktop.
2) Then I renamed the file "Tires-1.ods" in the Finder
--> Nothing happens in NeoOffice
3) Switch back to NeoOffice
--> Nothing happens in NeoOffice
4) Cmd-click the file icon in the window titlebar, see that it still is trying to reference "Tires.ods"
5) In the Finder, move "Tires-1.ods" to a folder on the Deskop
--> Nothing happens in NeoOffice
6) Repeat steps 3 and 4
--> The window still thinks the document is "Tires.ods" on the Desktop

Smokey

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pluby
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 6:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I found the problem. The Intel test patch was compiled without one file's changes as I did not properly add that one file to our CVS repository. The PowerPC test patch was fine so I properly added the one file and respun the Intel test patch.

Can you redownload and reinstall the Intel test patch and see if the new feature now works for you?

Patrick
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sardisson
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 09, 2010 12:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

With the updated test patch, I can either move or rename the file, once per session/before saving (I also have to make sure that NeoOffice is not the active active when I do moves, i.e. no dragging files to a new location without first switching to the Finder).

I'm not sure if people expect to be able to both move a file and rename it, or rename multiple times before saving, or other complex operations—on 10.5, TextEdit can do some complex sequences without saving, but not others—or not, but the basic single move and single rename bits are indeed working now for me on 10.5 Intel Smile

Smokey

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pluby
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 09, 2010 3:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

sardisson wrote:
With the updated test patch, I can either move or rename the file, once per session/before saving (I also have to make sure that NeoOffice is not the active active when I do moves, i.e. no dragging files to a new location without first switching to the Finder).


I am not sure what the problem is that you are describing. Are you dragging a file within the same volume? If so, wait 60 seconds as that is the timer that checks for moved files only checks every 60 seconds to keep CPU usage reasonable. The other times that NeoOffice will check is when a document becomes the focus window or when you save a document.

Patrick
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