Max just made "Oracle", so he trinity officially affirms that he speaks with great wisdom! Congratulations on 200 posts!
I think (but Jake really knows) that the problem is with text in static template/skin files. Any new text we enter on neowikifr.sixthcrusade.com displays and stores accents fine and is UTF-8.
C'est bizarre!
Smokey _________________ "[...] whether the duck drinks hot chocolate or coffee is irrelevant." -- ovvldc and sardisson in the NeoWiki
it may be me, but Happy and Bastille in the same sentance...
anyway.
I did think about MySQL, however, as smokey said, since the entries seem to work OK, i am pretty sure that it is working.
when I edit the french language page from the server with BBEdit, it looks fine too, but i don't know if that means anything (it could be some ISO thingy, right?)
and there is a rant in here somewhere about fonts and letters and stupid... grr..!!!>!>!>
i mean, you'd think... we'll I would think, apparently whoever thought this was a good idea DIDN'T think. sigh.
it may be me, but Happy and Bastille in the same sentance...
anyway.
Yeah, what is the proper phrase there? It'd like Eid/Ramadan (although "Happy" sort-of works), which is Mubarak and gets translated "Blessed."
Smokey
P.S. Jake, what happened with the test I suggested? _________________ "[...] whether the duck drinks hot chocolate or coffee is irrelevant." -- ovvldc and sardisson in the NeoWiki
Joined: May 31, 2003 Posts: 219 Location: French Alps
Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2005 11:12 am Post subject:
sardisson wrote:
And speaking of our French friends, a Happy Bastille Day to all of you!
IMO this was a great day, a true revolutionary one, demolishing a highly symbolic dungeon…
The real problem is that this date has been stolen to aquire a nationalist falvour, which is anything but progressive.
Thre are many other date, words etc. which lost there progressive significance, like "liberal" which is now a synonym to selfish capitalism (which is a pleonasm anyway).
And speaking of our French friends, a Happy Bastille Day to all of you!
IMO this was a great day, a true revolutionary one, demolishing a highly symbolic dungeon…
The irony is that, as with many symbols, the reason why the Parisions stormed the Bastille was to acquire the weapons stored there as there were only a handful of people imprisoned there at the time....
I agree about the nationalism, though. What continued to amuse me in the last few years is that the Statue of Liberty is a French Lady . _________________ "What do you think of Western Civilization?"
"I think it would be a good idea!"
- Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi
And speaking of our French friends, a Happy Bastille Day to all of you!
IMO this was a great day, a true revolutionary one, demolishing a highly symbolic dungeon…
The irony is that, as with many symbols, the reason why the Parisions stormed the Bastille was to acquire the weapons stored there as there were only a handful of people imprisoned there at the time....
I agree about the nationalism, though. What continued to amuse me in the last few years is that the Statue of Liberty is a French Lady .
Thankfully she's fully clothed, or some of our glorious leaders might have combined the two and insisted she be used for target-practice, though.
To liberty and freedom and the hope that one day all will share in them.
Smokey _________________ "[...] whether the duck drinks hot chocolate or coffee is irrelevant." -- ovvldc and sardisson in the NeoWiki
P.S. Jake, what happened with the test I suggested?
So Jake ran the test I asked, which was to upload a known-good UTF-8-encoded file, and with the ISO-8859-1 translation off, the file uploaded fine.
The MediaWiki "upload" did not, however; same problem as always.
Since we've ruled out the FTP client and we've (at least on this side of the pond) ruled out the MySQL (since pages we create with accents are preserved), that leaves the PHP scripts perhaps?
Max (and others), any more ideas?
Smokey _________________ "[...] whether the duck drinks hot chocolate or coffee is irrelevant." -- ovvldc and sardisson in the NeoWiki
Joined: May 31, 2003 Posts: 219 Location: French Alps
Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2005 3:25 pm Post subject:
sardisson wrote:
Max (and others), any more ideas?
Well, I read again the preceding pages to check I didn't miss anything but there still are a few unclear points. Did someone checked the template encoding? Are you sure they are utf-8? You may mail me one of them to check it out.
My gess is that these templates may be corrupted as smokey suggested long ago, since we all see two bytes for each accented char (which is correct) but with bad codes.
sardisson wrote:
The MediaWiki "upload" did not
What do you mean exactly what did you upload, an how? A template or a content (I do not use/know mediawiki)
What do you mean exactly what did you upload, an how? A template or a content (I do not use/know mediawiki)
I don't know for sure, either...if this keeps up, I'm going to have download and try to set it up myself My impression is that it is a collection of HTML/PHP/scripts....
Jake is gone for the weekend, so I guess we'll have to wait until Monday for more info....
Smokey _________________ "[...] whether the duck drinks hot chocolate or coffee is irrelevant." -- ovvldc and sardisson in the NeoWiki
i uploaded the mediawiki files (1.4.5) to the server with the ISO translation off. If I open the FR language PHP file in BBEdit from the server, i can see all of the accents correctly (but this was true before the re-upload as well)
if you 'view source' on the main wiki page, you can see the encoding at the top.
I have two thoughts. One is, that even though they are now properly uploaded, there was something messed up during set-up, so I need to re-set up the site. THis i'll try when I get back.
Two, that there are certain packages, functions, files, etc, you need with PHP to do UTF-8, and I don't have them. I did poke around PHP.net for a few minutes but was not able to tell if this may be the case.
Joined: May 31, 2003 Posts: 219 Location: French Alps
Posted: Sat Jul 16, 2005 6:46 am Post subject:
jakeOSX wrote:
If I open the FR language PHP file in BBEdit from the server, i can see all of the accents correctly (but this was true before the re-upload as well)
Right, but how is the BBedit charset setting when you see the correct chars?
I it's UTF-8 then the php code is suspect. Check it for calls to recode(), recode_string() or recode_file() functions. If there are suche calls they might be controled by some configuration variables, possibly incorect.
If it's not utf-8, the skin needs transcoding to utf-8. Gnu utiliy "recode" is good for this.
Let us know
jakeOSX wrote:
if you 'view source' on the main wiki page, you can see the encoding at the top.
Yes, but this is not a guaranty that the text inside is properly encoded.
I looked briefly at the mediawiki web site but was not able to find the French skin related stuff.
Edit: i Found this interesting notice (at this link, at the top of the neowikifr page):
Quote:
General considerations
If you are making a UTF-8 localization, this line will have to be placed somewhere in the beginning (or end) of the LanguageXx.php file:
require_once( "LanguageUtf8.php" );
Edit: i Found this interesting notice (at this link, at the top of the neowikifr page):
Quote:
General considerations
If you are making a UTF-8 localization, this line will have to be placed somewhere in the beginning (or end) of the LanguageXx.php file:
require_once( "LanguageUtf8.php" );
Is it the case?
Max
I saw that same link and quote, but I thought it sounded like that note was for people doing translations (localizations) of MediaWiki into their language, rather than for a user installing the language. I suppose it's possible that the French translator used ISO-8859-1 rather than UTF-8, but that seems a little odd.
Edit: I just opened the LanguageFr.php file from the MediaWiki 1.4.7 tarball, and it does indeed have the require_once( "LanguageUtf8.php" ); line.
The mystery continues.... It may well be as Jake speculated that something is still hanging around from the very first install of NeoWikiFR when Jake accidentally chose Latin1....
Smokey _________________ "[...] whether the duck drinks hot chocolate or coffee is irrelevant." -- ovvldc and sardisson in the NeoWiki
Joined: May 31, 2003 Posts: 219 Location: French Alps
Posted: Sat Jul 16, 2005 2:56 pm Post subject:
Well,
I dlded the tarball, looked at the French language file. It's utf-8. Period.
Then read the README and RELEASE NOTES, then had a fresh look at the mediaWiki localization page.
There are clear notice about mysql 4.1, as I already warned. So we definitely need to know which one is used on Jake server.
The "skin" message are imported in the database at install time. If they are then corrupted...
You can configure the wiki not to use the database message but rather the file messages. Its clearly explained on the same localization page :
Quote:
Updating messages/changing language
At install time, the interface messages are imported to the database so you can customize them. (See MediaWiki namespace). If you then change the language by setting something like $wgLanguageCode = "de"; in LocalSettings.php or want to get a fresh copy of the default messages, you can do one of two things:
Set $wgUseDatabaseMessages = false; in LocalSettings.php (line is in DefaultSettings.php as of 1.4x, but copy them to LocalSettings.php) to disable the support for the MediaWiki namespace. This means you'll have to customize things by hand in LanguageXx.php, will lose your changes at the next upgrade if you don't carefully merge, and can't use template messages for other purposes.
Run maintenance/rebuildMessages.php to re-import the messages. This needs to run from the command line, and you must set up an AdminSettings.php (see AdminSettings.sample; it's easy). If you don't have command-line access, you may need to hack up the scripts; the maintenance scripts are not designed to run from the web since it's not safe to leave them exposed that way.
cd maintenance
php rebuildMessages.php --rebuild
NOTE: To get maintenance/rebuildMessages.php to run, you need make sure that "register_argc_argv" is "On" in php.ini .
My bet is that setting
Code:
$wgUseDatabaseMessages = false;
in LocalSettings.php is likely to resolve the problem.
I didn't quite follow what Max wrote (my technical threshold in PHP/MySQL is *very* low), but I did read some more of the MediaWiki i18n page and started trying links it mentioned.
Look at this (the ones in red differ from the default); somehow it has the defaults for all the messages with the correct accents!
I'd think that means they weren't corrupted by MySQL since the defaults are correct, but this is over my head (Maybe it's reading the defaults from the flat file and the "acutal" ones from the db? EditEr, that's exactly what Max is saying, once I reread his message a third time )
However, that does mean anyone with sysop priviliges can edit the messages manually and fix them (only Jake has sysop priviliges on NeoWikiFR). EditEr, Max's solution is simpler, now that I understand things a little
Hooray for Max!
Next problem: get the namespace mapping working on both wikis so we can do interwiki links in the form of Fr:Accueil and En:Main_Page (to list, and link, those two pages as equivalent)
Smokey _________________ "[...] whether the duck drinks hot chocolate or coffee is irrelevant." -- ovvldc and sardisson in the NeoWiki
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Congratulations on 200 posts!
My impression is that it is a collection of HTML/PHP/scripts....