OOo Aqua

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OK, fair enough, we'll have to wait and see but historically JAVA just seems to run slower on Mac PPC (i.e internet, my hand-me-down Gateway is much faster on the net w/only 128MB RAM than my G4iMac w/512MB RAM, just seems longer for ads to render on a Mac, JAVA or javascript or whatever), maybe the Intel changeover changed all that, I don't have that MacBook yet to verify.
Just sayin' that if you take 2 apps side by side, the JAVA app will run noticably slower than the non-JAVA one on a Mac...
Agree though, Neo is much prettier now but as I said in another thread, in the end it's all about speed (and stability) for most so if they pull it off they will capture the market (well, not really, we all know who has monopolized that)...

Have a nice Labor Day Holiday everyone, I'll try to. Speaking of labor, it's crunch time at my new workplace, I need to produce or I'm gonna get the boot...

amayze · Posted: Sat Sep 02, 2006 11:35 am Post subject:

I have to say I don't get this whole Java/no Java argument.

The option to choose which Java VM to use wasn't added by Patrick, its there in OpenOffice too. Java is at the core of many features of OpenOffice. Whithout Java there would be no Wizards and certain other functions too. Unless OpenOffice goes through a significant re-write Java will always be there.

If/when the OOo Mac porting team release an "official" native version of OpenOffice for Mac it will use Java. At some point you will have to wait for the VM to start, as you do with NeoOffice - it just might not be at launch time.

So, a UI that uses no Java may well be a bit snappier than one that does use elements of Java, but the underlying application will be the exact same code. When the native port is released we'll all be able to see the differences for ourselves, and if its significant I'm sure I will consider switching. At the moment however its all just speculation, and I know for a fact that an existing released application will always run faster on my Mac than one that isn't released yet! Wink

Andy

aussie149 · Posted: Sat Sep 02, 2006 5:13 pm Post subject:

LemonAid · Posted: Sat Sep 02, 2006 6:03 pm Post subject:

yoxi · Posted: Sun Sep 03, 2006 2:17 am Post subject:

Bloody oath...

Waldo · Oracle Joined: Dec 03, 2004 Posts: 239

OOo (non aqua) 2.0.3 is out.

W

Samwise · Posted: Sun Sep 03, 2006 12:55 pm Post subject:

It was actually released over a month ago (around July 20) in French and German, and in English since August 8. It's wierd that both VersionTracker and MacUpdate only "announced" it yesterday.

ovvldc · Posted: Sun Sep 03, 2006 2:48 pm Post subject:

Apricot · Pure-blooded Human Joined: May 31, 2003 Posts: 38

Yep, I haven't been posting or testing much since my daughter arrived last year! But clearly everyone else has been doing a great job.

I've been trying to live in NeoJ as much as possible and I must say that in the Intel era, the only thing I really miss is the ability of the window bar to pop up a file's enclosing folders and to drag a file's icon around. I have no idea how hard that would be for NeoJ to incorporate...

OPENSTEP · Posted: Mon Sep 04, 2006 3:00 pm Post subject: Re: hi smokey

MacRat · Posted: Mon Sep 04, 2006 10:01 pm Post subject: Re: hi smokey

human · Posted: Thu Sep 07, 2006 10:16 am Post subject:

I have to second that. A lot depends on how much Java you're using and what you're using it for. Anybody ever try Thinkfree Office? That little turkey was a brilliant concept that was an absolute disaster in execution. It was a cross-platform office suite written entirely in java. It ran equally well (or poorly, as the case may be) on Windows, Mac OS 9 and OS X. It was the most painfully slow application I have ever tried to run on any computer, and it was even more painfully short on features. By comparison, NeoOffice is quite sprightly.

I'm sure that once a native OOo for OS X comes out, it will resort to some of the same tricks the Windows version uses to give the illusion of speed, such as "Quick Launch", which partially launches the application when the system boots and keeps it dormant in the background, quietly sucking up system resources, until it's needed.

val1984 · Oracle Joined: May 30, 2005 Posts: 229 Location: France

kberg · Agent Joined: May 28, 2006 Posts: 18

OPENSTEP · Posted: Tue Sep 19, 2006 8:26 am Post subject:

Thanks for the 411! For some controls I believe they are using the same lower-level calls that we are, but yes, they do have a long way to go and I wish them luck. For better or for worse, in our experience users are more than happy to exchange Aqua controls for more needed functionality like correct printing. This is why we chose to spend so much time (years, actually) getting the foundations right. As I'm sure both Patrick and the issuees in BZ can tell you, that's not the fun part Very Happy

If they do decide to go with higher HIViews or other Carbon controls for drawing, they'll need to watch the event handling closely as events are not sent to the application target but rather to the subview target first for processing.

Technically HITheme and Appearance are also part of Carbon, so we use Carbon as well Smile

There are still some controls (buttons, checkboxes) that are being done via Swing, but those will most likely eventually disappear. Similar to Carbon, Swing does have a "lightweight" method that can draw a control into a Graphics without embedding the control into a JFrame, without event handling, or other overhead. While this was my initial approach since Swing handles things like shadow adornments and focus rings within button bounds more gradefully than Carbon, eventually we ran into roadblocks with Swing not exposing enough state for controls and with Swing doing deferred threaded drawing in the Apple VM.

ed