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NeoOffice :: View topic - Text navigating - Menu and Keyboard Shortcuts
Text navigating - Menu and Keyboard Shortcuts
 
   NeoOffice Forum Index -> NeoWiki and Website Development
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w_m0zart
Red Pill


Joined: Mar 24, 2008
Posts: 6

PostPosted: Mon Mar 24, 2008 12:33 pm    Post subject: Text navigating - Menu and Keyboard Shortcuts

The NeoOffice wiki regarding 'Menu and Keyboard Shortcuts' is a bit messy. Therefore it is quite difficult to extract proper information on how to configure exactly NeoOffice and OSX in order to navigate through text as expected on a Mac.

To solve this problem that once it is rewritten, future versions will create a kind of mess again, my suggestion is to start that wiki topic with a NeoOffice version and OSX version 'referrer'.

For a solution 'from scratch' how NeoOffice and OSX should be configured, I collected and rewrote the information on that page on my own wiki, where on a step by step basis can be seen what should be set where.
It deals with:
* Navigating to beginning & end of line
* Navigating to beginning & end of a word
* Navigating and selecting the beginning & end of line
* Navigating and selecting the beginning & end of a word

A link to this wiki:
http://www.auditeon.com/software:neooffice:keyboard_navigating_shortcuts

When I have a wiki account, I will try to copy/move this information to the official NeoOffice wiki. but if someone else would like to do that, please don't hesitate...

My configuration to which the information on the previous link applies is:
* NeoOffice 2.2.2
* OS X 10.4
* Java runtime environment 1.4.2_16


Last edited by w_m0zart on Mon Mar 24, 2008 1:06 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Samwise
Captain Naiobi


Joined: Apr 25, 2006
Posts: 2315
Location: Montpellier, France

PostPosted: Mon Mar 24, 2008 12:38 pm    Post subject:

Moved to NeoWiki Development.
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sardisson
Town Crier
Town Crier


Joined: Feb 01, 2004
Posts: 4588

PostPosted: Mon Mar 24, 2008 3:08 pm    Post subject: Re: Text navigating - Menu and Keyboard Shortcuts

w_m0zart wrote:
The NeoOffice wiki regarding 'Menu and Keyboard Shortcuts' is a bit messy.

No argument there Wink

However, the vast majority of the information applies to all NeoOffice 2.2.x installations (there's no need for any information about versions of NeoOffice < 2.2.x there anymore). Things are only broken with Java 1.5. Rather than repeat things over and over again needlessly, I'd much prefer a brief note about Java 1.5's brokenness (and the fact Intel users can't use Java 1.4.2).

Other than that (and the nasty fact that as Mac OS X moves forward, it keeps developing more bugs that break our work-arounds Evil or Very Mad ), I'd certainly welcome anyone willing to spend some time working on that page Wink

Smokey

_________________
"[...] whether the duck drinks hot chocolate or coffee is irrelevant." -- ovvldc and sardisson in the NeoWiki
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w_m0zart
Red Pill


Joined: Mar 24, 2008
Posts: 6

PostPosted: Mon Mar 24, 2008 3:33 pm    Post subject:

Quote:
Rather than repeat things over and over again needlessly

Things which other users may have heard over and over, have been new for me. One shoud realize that at all times new people can join, who haven't got any previous knowledge about any previous issues.

I am such a user and found the messy wiki page about shortcut keys with contradicting and superfluous information. I had to extract the relevant information which applied to my situation, which was not very unique after all. I can imagine there are a lot of other users who find themselves in a similar situation and are especially less keen on understanding Java issues and System Preferences. Therefore I thought this page should present the information in such a way that also new users may find their way there.
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sardisson
Town Crier
Town Crier


Joined: Feb 01, 2004
Posts: 4588

PostPosted: Mon Mar 24, 2008 8:44 pm    Post subject:

w_m0zart wrote:
Quote:
Rather than repeat things over and over again needlessly

Things which other users may have heard over and over, have been new for me. One shoud realize that at all times new people can join, who haven't got any previous knowledge about any previous issues.

I meant repeat most of the information by version, etc., not information people might not have heard; sorry I wasn't clear.

It seemed like you were proposing
Code:
NeoOffice 2.2.2/Java 1.4/Mac OS X 10.3

-text text text

NeoOffice 2.2.2/Java 1.4.2/Mac OS X 10.4

-text text text

NeoOffice 2.2.2/Java 1.5/Mac OS X 10.4

-text text text

NeoOffice 2.2.2/Java 1.4.2/Mac OS X 10.5

-text text text

NeoOffice 2.2.2/Java 1.5/Mac OS X 10.5

-text text text


Whereas I'd prefer
Code:

-text text* text

* This is broken on Java 1.5


Smokey

_________________
"[...] whether the duck drinks hot chocolate or coffee is irrelevant." -- ovvldc and sardisson in the NeoWiki
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w_m0zart
Red Pill


Joined: Mar 24, 2008
Posts: 6

PostPosted: Sun Mar 30, 2008 3:23 pm    Post subject:

Quote:
I'd certainly welcome anyone willing to spend some time working on that page

Well it seems that the statement above that article:
Quote:
This article is not up to date, or it needs structural or stylistic changes to conform with the rest of this wiki. You can help the NeoOffice community by fixing it
is quite meaningless. I can't edit a page, because it's locked. Who holds the 'key' to unlock it? I think the statement should explain that at least.

Things I'd like to change as well are:
The first paragraph at the beginning of that page concerning " Pre-Made Keyboard Configurations" should be not at the beginning, as NeoOffice 2.x has in the meantime become mainstream. Now it's quite irritating to read something and then at the bottom of that paragraph find a text like 'But this information will not work with the current version'
Move the important information where is described how the keyboard reconfiguration can be changed for a current NeoOffice version at the bottom of that page to the top.
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Lorinda
Captain Mifune


Joined: Jun 20, 2006
Posts: 2051
Location: Midwest, USA

PostPosted: Sun Mar 30, 2008 4:25 pm    Post subject:

It's not technically locked, but our wiki is set up to require users request an account and then log in order to edit pages. This is due to major problems with vandalism that happened when the wiki was completely open. (Some pages are locked, meaning that not even registered wiki users can modify them, unless they are administrators)

Instructions on getting a user account can be found here. I thought this was explained when those without accounts tried to edit pages, but I just checked and I see I remembered incorrectly.

I would agree it would help to include a note about this in the Fixme template. But it's possible there's a reason it's not there already.

I have just commented out the first section, since it no longer applies. I would agree the article needs some rewriting. I discovered I even have some notes on the discussion page in that regard. I was hesitant to tackle it at the time, since I didn't completely understand all the issues discussed. I'll put it on my to-do list, unless someone beats me to it.

Lorinda
friendly wiki elf

Note to translators: you might want to wait to translate the revised page until it has been "vetted." Once I've made the revisions I'll either add to this thread or start a new one for fellow wiki elves (and other interested parties) to comment on, so more changes may be forthcoming after my initial editing.
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Lorinda
Captain Mifune


Joined: Jun 20, 2006
Posts: 2051
Location: Midwest, USA

PostPosted: Sun Mar 30, 2008 8:10 pm    Post subject:

Okay, I've started my work, and now I need some "testing" help from others.

I just rewrote the section on Using System Preferences to set keyboard shortcuts.

On my machine, 10.4.11 (PPC), I can only successfully set keyboard shortcuts through System Preferences for items in the NeoOffice menu. My notes in the Discussion page indicate that it should work in other menus if I shift to java 1.4. Initially, it looked like this was so. My first attemmpt to access a menu item this way worked, or it seemed to. But I was unable to get it to work again, even after restarting Neo.

Are the results any different for those using 10.4.11 on an Intel machine?

My notes also say the process works correctly on 10.3.9. Does this include using the option key (in combination with the Command key) in menus other than the NeoOffice menu?

Finally, what about Leopard?

I have more questions about the rest of the article, but I think I'll hold off until I get this puzzle solved.

Lorinda
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jgd
Agent Smith


Joined: Feb 27, 2005
Posts: 1531
Location: France

PostPosted: Mon Mar 31, 2008 2:01 am    Post subject:

Lorinda wrote:

Finally, what about Leopard?

In Leopard he situation is the same as in 10.4.11. You can only assign shortcuts to items in the NeoOffice menu.

Furthermore, the indications given in this page about the impossibility of using the option key in Java 1-5 don't apply anymore. I assigned Cmd-Opt-M to "À partir d'un modèle…" (From Template…), and it works.

Jacqueline
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Lorinda
Captain Mifune


Joined: Jun 20, 2006
Posts: 2051
Location: Midwest, USA

PostPosted: Mon Mar 31, 2008 5:01 am    Post subject:

Thanks, Jacqueline! I can use the opt key for keyboard shortcuts in the NeoOffice menu, too. I think I'm remembering correctly that it is a native menu, while all the others are Java drawn. I'll clarify that in the article you mentioned.

Do you still have a 10.4 installation (PPC or Intel) to double check my results with java 1.4, or are you only Leopard these days?

Lorinda
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jgd
Agent Smith


Joined: Feb 27, 2005
Posts: 1531
Location: France

PostPosted: Mon Mar 31, 2008 7:02 am    Post subject:

Lorinda wrote:

Do you still have a 10.4 installation (PPC or Intel) to double check my results with java 1.4, or are you only Leopard these days?
Lorinda

Sorry,I don't have Tiger anymore Sad

Jacqueline
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Lorinda
Captain Mifune


Joined: Jun 20, 2006
Posts: 2051
Location: Midwest, USA

PostPosted: Mon Mar 31, 2008 7:33 am    Post subject:

No problem. I just couldn't remember. Hopefully someone else can check. if not, that's o.k. too.

Lorinda
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w_m0zart
Red Pill


Joined: Mar 24, 2008
Posts: 6

PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 1:52 am    Post subject: tiger

Jacqueline, you are making it quite confusing with 'JRE 1.5 works'.

Read in the footnote what I wrote about JRE 1.5 on:
"In JRE 1.5 the shortcut to the menu option seems to be selected: the menu flashes shortly, but after that the expected action does not follow."
I explain there that the Edit-menu turns shortly blue, which means that (probably) the function 'To Word Left' which I added there, had been selected, but the expected action did not follow.

So, the option key does not work correctly with Tiger (10.4.11) and JRE 1.5. Once again, when I assigned the [option + left] key for navigating to the previous word, (Added in the edit menu 'To Word Left' and added in the system preferences a keyboard shortcut) I can not navigate to a previous word. Instead it just navigates a single character to the left, which is the same as pressing just the [left] key without the [option] key. When I then disable JRE 1.5 and enable JRE 1.4, the cursor suddenly does navigate to a word left.

Can it be that some functions will work with JRE 1.5 and some will not? Can you try to add the cursor navigating functions which I described so detailed in the link above about functionality in Leopard/ JRE 1.5?
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jgd
Agent Smith


Joined: Feb 27, 2005
Posts: 1531
Location: France

PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 2:16 am    Post subject:

Sorry, but I confirm that the option key works in NeoOffice menu. I successfully assigned Cmd-Opt-M to NeoOffice > From Template…, on Intel, PPC, French and English versions running Leopard (10.5.2).

Lorinda tested this possibility in 10.4.11, and found that it works.

Quote:
On my machine, 10.4.11 (PPC), I can only successfully set keyboard shortcuts through System Preferences for items in the NeoOffice menu


I confirm that it's the same in 10.5.2 with Java 1.5.

You cannot assign a shortcut to any other menu or submenu, such as File, Edit, etc via the System Preferences, with or without the opt key. I've never said that it was possible Wink

Jacqueline
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w_m0zart
Red Pill


Joined: Mar 24, 2008
Posts: 6

PostPosted: Wed Apr 02, 2008 8:21 am    Post subject:

I asked you to test specifically the cursor navigating functions which I described in such a great detail in the link above, because cursor navigation is something different than [pressing command+option+M]. (the cursor 'arrow' keys have a default function which is to advance one character, which is in my situation prevailing above the function 'To Word ...' )
I explained as well, that JRE 1.5 indeed does not seem to hinder the keypress of [option+cursor], because the edit-menu flashes blue shortly. But after this flash, not the expected function follows, but only a single character cursor movement. So did you test that?

If you configured it like I did, you should see something like the following screenshots:
Screenshot 1: the edit menu in NeoOffice with added navigation functions


Screenshot 2: the system preferences - keyboard shortcuts pane


Quote:
You cannot assign a shortcut to any other menu or submenu, such as File, Edit, etc via the System Preferences, with or without the opt key.

I have proven that I can, did I?
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