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NeoOffice :: View topic - Aqua menu patch available for testing
Aqua menu patch available for testing
 
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pluby
The Architect
The Architect


Joined: Jun 16, 2003
Posts: 11932

PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 7:03 am    Post subject: Re: Printing issue Reply with quote

Tim wrote:
I can reproduce the printing hangup here (10.3.5, Pismo 500MHz, Deskjet 920C on a Jetdirect via Airport.) It prints perfectly if I hit "OK" in the Print Dialog, but if I try any dropdowns, the app hangs on the Beachball. Using the latest Aqua patch.


FYI. This bug has been fixed and will be in the next patch that I release.

Patrick
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tlunde
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 9:23 am    Post subject: applying multiple patches? Reply with quote

Patrick -

Having just downloaded the 127M of Alpha 2, I was about to apply "Patch 3-Aqua Menus". Before I do, I'd like to make sure that I need not re-download things unnecessarily when you release the patch (Patch 4?) that fixes the printing problem.

Do I:

1) Install Alpha 2 and apply P3/Aqua now. When the new patch comes out, then apply it directly to this installation? Or

2) Use what I have now, and keep the downloaded installers around because when the new patch comes out I'll need to throw away the installed version (under /Applications) and reinstall Alpha 2 + Patch 4?

Or

3) Will "patch 4" require a later Alpha and I'll have to re-download everything anyway? Wink

Thanks for all of your hard work!
thomas
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pluby
The Architect
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Joined: Jun 16, 2003
Posts: 11932

PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 9:28 am    Post subject: Re: applying multiple patches? Reply with quote

tlunde wrote:
1) Install Alpha 2 and apply P3/Aqua now. When the new patch comes out, then apply it directly to this installation?


Yes. I include all of the files from previous patches in each new patch. This makes it easy for testers to keep applying the latest patch during the times (like during 1.1 Alpha 1) when I am generating patches every few days.

Patrick
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OPENSTEP
The One
The One


Joined: May 25, 2003
Posts: 4752
Location: Santa Barbara, CA

PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 9:32 am    Post subject: Re: printing problems Reply with quote

fabriziovenerandi wrote:
neooffice uses around 96Mb of real memory, and a 1Gb (!) of virtual memory


This is on par with regular OpenOffice.org X11 on Mac OS X. These are not small applications. Still, to use the app effectively you will need to have lots of memory installed in your computer, at least. 256MB is really no longer enough to run Mac OS X and a lot of applications. You should upgrade to at least 512MB for running everything smoother, not just neoj. Memory is cheap, too.

fabriziovenerandi wrote:
... the pb slows doooown using neooffice...


Speed is not the utmost concern for either Patrick or myself. My 4 main reasons for this are (Patrick, feel free to chime in if I'm putting words in your mouth):

1) I've used NeoOffice/J on a PowerMac G5 and it's just as responsive as Word, if not faster. For a "long term" strategy of a couple years out, it's not worth the effort of spending precious manpower trying to tweak every little bit of speed out of it by reordering instructions, reordering bytecode, etc. since it's already obviously not a long-term problem that's evidence of a fundamental software issue.

2) One of the fundamental tenets Patrick has used (and that I agree with) is to make it work first, then worry about making it clean or optimal. Much better that it be slower and working then fast and broken.

3) The main performance goal of the project is to prevent regressions from its current performance levels. But some fundamental functionality may result in the app slowing down slightly, and that may just have to be the way it will be (e.g. delay before menus are first shown in the native menubar is unavoidable).

4) If speed is really your primary concern (or Aqua LAF, or any other area where OOo and NeoJ are weak) feel free to go out and buy a copy of Microsoft Office X / 2004. They're really great products and aren't outrageously priced for the amount of software you get. If you think about the number of aggregate man-hours spent on Microsoft Office for the Mac through the years, the price really is kind of silly. Unlike things like Quark where the price has been steadily rising, Office is one of the few big software packages where the prices have leveled or even decreased.

ed
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fabrizio.venerandi
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 10:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

first of all, I think the work you are making is great. my criticism is only as 'consumer' point of view. for my personal writing I use other word processor programs, like lightwaytext or mellel, that could run with my pb without speed problem.
in my office I used openoffice for windows to do a real big spreadsheet document, so I was happy for the mac release of openoffice and neooffice to use the mac not only for my personal use, but for my office's works too.
but actually the needs of ram of neooffice/openoffice are really heavy. I was hoping for a more clean code, but I can understand two only programmer could not do the same work of a payed team of programmers.

thank you for the answer.
and sorry for my english.


f.
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pluby
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Joined: Jun 16, 2003
Posts: 11932

PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 10:42 am    Post subject: Re: printing problems Reply with quote

fabriziovenerandi wrote:
ps. here pb 12'' 1,33, 256Mb the biggest problem is the speed: neooffice uses around 96Mb of real memory, and a 1Gb (!) of virtual memory... the pb slows doooown using neooffice... actually openoffice on a 800mhz windows machine is more faster that neooffice on my 1,33ghz pb....


Actually, Neo/J does not use 1 GB of memory. Instead, Java grabs about 0.5 GB of virtual memory at startup even though Neo/J nearly always uses less than 0.1 GB of Java memory. This "preemptive" grabbing of virtual memory by Java is an unusual behavior on Mac OS X. On other platforms (using Sun's Java) virtual memory is grabbed only when the application actually needs it.

Anyways, since Neo/J does not actually use that virtual memory, there is no performance hit because the virtual memory manager will attach real memory (or swap disk space) if Neo/J really needs that much memory.

Patrick
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tlunde
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 10:43 am    Post subject: New menus look great. Slight rendering bug report Reply with quote

Bug report (would something this small find a home in Bugzilla?):

With the menus patch applied, switching from normal mode to full screen (and back and always thereafter while a given window is open), a small strip of white appears at the top of the window and is not properly redrawn.

sardisson reported (on page 4 of this thread) that there appeared to be a double line at the top of the window resulting from the movement of the menus to the top of the screen.

It is this double-line, I think, that is not getting redrawn.

This slight niggle aside, *Rah* *Rah* *Rah*! Keep going guys!

NeoOffice/J _now_ finally looks mac-like enough that I'll be able to switch my users to it. Thanks.
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tlunde
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 10:59 am    Post subject: rendering bug followup Reply with quote

The white strip does get repainted correctly when I switch away from NeoOffice/J to another application and back.
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pluby
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Joined: Jun 16, 2003
Posts: 11932

PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:27 am    Post subject: Re: New menus look great. Slight rendering bug report Reply with quote

tlunde wrote:
Bug report (would something this small find a home in Bugzilla?):


This was already filed in Bugzilla under bug 169 last week.

Patrick
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M-Rick
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 6:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have a problem, I can't save any file. With or without the Aqua menu patch, when I click on save, NeoOffice doesn't save nothing and the dialog box stays like this waiting for ...
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pluby
The Architect
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Joined: Jun 16, 2003
Posts: 11932

PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 8:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

M-Rick wrote:
I have a problem, I can't save any file. With or without the Aqua menu patch, when I click on save, NeoOffice doesn't save nothing and the dialog box stays like this waiting for ...


This sounds like your user configuration files have somehow become corrupted. You can verify if this is the case by doing the steps listed in the second posting in the following forum topic:

http://trinity.neooffice.org/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=740&start=0&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=

Patrick
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OPENSTEP
The One
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Joined: May 25, 2003
Posts: 4752
Location: Santa Barbara, CA

PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 9:46 pm    Post subject: Re: printing problems Reply with quote

pluby wrote:
Anyways, since Neo/J does not actually use that virtual memory, there is no performance hit because the virtual memory manager will attach real memory (or swap disk space) if Neo/J really needs that much memory.


I was thinking more on the terms of wired memory when you start adding together OOo X11, X11 server itself, ghostscript/pstopdf for printing, window manager, etc. The baggage for fully running even the X11 version is quite large as well when all of the supporting apps are taken into question...supporting apps that aren't needed by the java vcl Very Happy

ed
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 9:47 pm    Post subject: OO.o 1.1.3 Reply with quote

Apologies if this is answered elsewhere, but I noticed that OOo 1.1.3 is out. Will changes be acquired by N/J?

http://download.openoffice.org/1.1.3/release_notes_1.1.3.html
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OPENSTEP
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Joined: May 25, 2003
Posts: 4752
Location: Santa Barbara, CA

PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 10:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OOo X11 Mac OS X isn't at 1.1.3 yet, and Neo/J builds off of it. In general, Patrick in the past hasn't rushed to keep up with the bleeding edge of OOo, rather just moving to major releases as they become stable for X11.

In reality, OOo moves way too fast to keep up with every RC and point release with limited manpower, even for the X11 version. The amount of time that we'd have to spend on just doing "maintenance" and recompiling would suck away all the time we need doing all the other bugfixing and fun porting work Smile

ed
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fabrizio.venerandi
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 13, 2004 12:08 am    Post subject: keys assignement Reply with quote

using the 'aqua' version of neooffice I got this problem: I assigned a key combination (apple-shift-J) to a macro. All was working fine with the old version. Using the 'aqua' version the apple-shift-j is used for the full screen option, and my configuration is not used.


f.
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