Posted: Sun Feb 06, 2005 3:07 am Post subject: Enlisting Able (but willing?) Help For NeoOffice Programming
Greetings!
I'm going to show how naive I am here since all my non-programmer expertise can offer NeoOffice is a couple of strapped bucks, but with all the half-idle Mac shareware and freeware writers there are out there, can't they be recruited to help Ed and Patrick out? Maybe a token gift like a Sun sweatshirt or baseball cap to entice them over? When I see Mac share/freeware authors valiantly spinning wheels on fine but on life-support efforts like iCab, these guys ought be lending that sweat and talent to a project that benefits the Mac masses, not merely a tiny niche.
At city and community colleges all over this nation there's new and seasoned talent just lolling around waiting to have their name emblazoned in the credits of a major software project (can you spell resume fodder?), and I can't imagine too many mega-projects with OpenOffice's stature outside writing Space Shuttle code. Can't this request be broadcasted on MacAddict and MacWorld and others Mac fan organs? (I'm REALLY disappointed by the tepid support the Mac mags have given NeoOffice. I guess they believe AppleWorks works well enough for Mac people - I mean REAL serious people use non-grade school grade MS Office, right?) Whatever happened to this famous Mac sense of maverick community and charity?
I just can't understand why Ed and Patrick seem to be the only ones toiling over code on a project that benefits the Mac universe far more than AppleWorks or iWorks or whatever lame suite effort Apple cranks out! When I glance reviews of people actually carping over NeoO's features and (beta!) maturity, I just have to shake my head in scorn and wonder if these malcontents ever heard the phrase of looking a gift horse in the mouth!
Joined: May 25, 2003 Posts: 4752 Location: Santa Barbara, CA
Posted: Sun Feb 06, 2005 9:26 am Post subject:
If you can think of any good way to get programmers interested in helping the project out, by all means please do I tried for many years at conferences like WWDC even, but thus far not too many have jumped onboard to help.
For what it's worth, one of the major turnoffs for most Mac developers it seems is that we're not using standard Apple tools or technologies for the development. A lot of developers have come on through and stated they'd love to help if they could design things in Interface Builder, but then they find out we don't do that and leave. So I guess from a developer point of view it takes a lot of patience or it takes trying to find one of those Linux-convert style developers that are already familiar with the command line tools and don't mind working without the Apple GUI tools.
I'm not sure if that information can help you start to develop any ideas...but one of the fundamental problems in recruiting for Neo are the same as recruiting for OOo X11: so many people want to do "Aqua" design and redo the interface but very few want to do the much more difficult task of maintenance and infrastructure development that's required to get us there.
I'm sure some developers are also put off by the way we handle "introducing" them to the project and the code. In general, we don't have the human bandwidth to handhold a lot of people through the initial building and debugging process. This is pretty thick stuff, and historically the "throw them in and let them swim" approach has kind of helped do a self-screening to let only dedicated developers with good skills through...and who also don't mind a little frustration along the way.
Anyway, if you can get any additional ideas please let me know. WWDC has proven to be the most successful developer "mindshare" place I've gone to. While we may not always find more core developers, we definitely build mindshare and get other developers aware of an alternative office solution. We get a decent bit of database developers, solutions integrators, systems administrators, and the like interested in the product. That's always good.
I'm sure some developers are also put off by the way we handle "introducing" them to the project and the code. In general, we don't have the human bandwidth to handhold a lot of people through the initial building and debugging process. This is pretty thick stuff, and historically the "throw them in and let them swim" approach has kind of helped do a self-screening to let only dedicated developers with good skills through...and who also don't mind a little frustration along the way.
Please don't take this the wrong way, but who exactly swam through?
I don't want to disrespect anyone with this question, and I respect the human bandwith problem, but I have seen only a few people getting into the OOo build process and not too many people at all here.
Actually, this reminds me of an interview I read somewhere with Mike Pinkerton. He was working on Camino almost singlehandedly at some point and had problems getting interested people involved. I don't recall the exact circumstances, but I do recall that his solution was (somewhat ironically) to start using the stuff he himself taught in OSS development classes. I guess he can explain it better . But I justed wanted to highlight that NeoOffice isn't the only project with this problem. I know Mike sometimes reades what is posted here, so I'll leave elaboration up to him.
OPENSTEP wrote:
Anyway, if you can get any additional ideas please let me know. WWDC has proven to be the most successful developer "mindshare" place I've gone to. While we may not always find more core developers, we definitely build mindshare and get other developers aware of an alternative office solution. We get a decent bit of database developers, solutions integrators, systems administrators, and the like interested in the product. That's always good.
That is certainly very good and whatever else could use improvement, this should stay. I have personally attended a dozen international conferences and the energy and contacts you give and take away from these are not just practical, but also very inspirational.
Best wishes,
Oscar _________________ "What do you think of Western Civilization?"
"I think it would be a good idea!"
- Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi
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I tried for many years at conferences like WWDC even, but thus far not too many have jumped onboard to help.
. But I justed wanted to highlight that NeoOffice isn't the only project with this problem. I know Mike sometimes reades what is posted here, so I'll leave elaboration up to him.