Posted: Wed Jul 04, 2007 4:43 am Post subject: NeoOffice doesn't load, icon disappears from dock
Hi everyone
I've known about the NeoOffice project for about 18 months or so but have been unable to ever get it to load.
I used to try on a G3 with Panther that we use here for testing and this same behaviour happens.
Today I tried it on a G4 iBook with the following specs from System Profiler:
Code:
System Version: Mac OS X 10.3.9 (7W98)
Kernel Version: Darwin 7.9.0
Machine Model: iBook G4
CPU Type: PowerPC G4 (1.1)
Number Of CPUs: 1
CPU Speed: 1.07 GHz
L2 Cache (per CPU): 512 KB
Memory: 768 MB
Bus Speed: 133 MHz
Boot ROM Version: 4.8.5f0
I downloaded the latest version, installed it, then installed the patch 7.
Created an alias to NeoOffice on the desktop then double clicked it to try starting NeoOffice.
The NeoOffice icon appears in the dock and starts to bounce as if the program is loading, then just vanishes from the dock and NeoOffice doesn't load.
No error messages or anything.
This has always been the problem since I tried using NeoOffice a couple of years ago.
Anyone know what's happening?
Or is there a way to get a debug report or something.
Maybe there's something I've not installed.
I don't have X11 installed on this machine, but I believed that was only needed for the actual OpenOffice distribution?
I just ran an Apple Update on that machine, installed anything that needed doing.
Then installed that Java Update, but I was still getting the same behaviour!
I was logged in as System Administrator, so I tried logging in as a regular user.
And success, the installation completes and NeoOffice fired up!!!
Just tried it on our old G3 and it seems to work on that as well.
So that's been my problem for years - I was logging in as System Administrator which seemed to be causing it to fail to start!
I hope this helps someone else out there!
I'm really pleased to be able to have our Mac guys running NeoOffice rather than MS Office as it seems a bit quicker to run.
The guys on the iBooks always seem to have problems with the speed everything runs at with Panther.
Joined: Apr 25, 2006 Posts: 2315 Location: Montpellier, France
Posted: Wed Jul 04, 2007 7:46 am Post subject:
NeoOffice should work with both admin and regular accounts. However, the fact that it works under the other account but not the admin user probably means that there's something wrong with the admin account rather than with NeoOffice ...
Joined: Dec 08, 2005 Posts: 291 Location: Berlin, Germany
Posted: Wed Jul 04, 2007 8:15 am Post subject:
As far as I understood the post, batfastad2 worked as "System Administrator", which is not a mere admin account, but the (Unix) root user. That may be a clue - Patrick or Ed may clarify, if that's the problem.
And, batfastad2, it's never a good idea to use the special root account for normal work.
NeoOffice failed to open on the root account on the iBook G4, a G5 and an old G3... running Panther, Tiger and Panther respectively.
But it worked 100% of the time when using a regular account.
On our Linux servers I never use root unless I actually need to change stuff.
But the head of the design studio sets up all the Macs to work as root all the time - it is not good I know, but he's very set in his ways and doesn't want to change anything
NeoOffice failed to open on the root account on the iBook G4, a G5 and an old G3... running Panther, Tiger and Panther respectively.
NeoOffice is set by design to not be able to run as root. If you run it as root, you will see a message to that effect in the /Application/Utilities/Console application.
Joined: Dec 08, 2005 Posts: 291 Location: Berlin, Germany
Posted: Wed Jul 04, 2007 8:49 am Post subject:
batfastad2 wrote:
But the head of the design studio sets up all the Macs to work as root all the time - it is not good I know, but he's very set in his ways and doesn't want to change anything
I'll bet he's one of the old school guys with a long and heavy Mac OS background - still confused, that the Desktop isn't the Desktop anymore. I know some of these.
Joined: Nov 21, 2005 Posts: 1285 Location: Witless Protection Program
Posted: Wed Jul 04, 2007 10:44 pm Post subject:
doctype wrote:
batfastad2 wrote:
But the head of the design studio sets up all the Macs to work as root all the time - it is not good I know, but he's very set in his ways and doesn't want to change anything
I'll bet he's one of the old school guys with a long and heavy Mac OS background - still confused, that the Desktop isn't the Desktop anymore. I know some of these.
He should listen to his Linux-savy employee.
Bad, BAD. It is VERY BAD to set Macs to work as root.
Good Mac OS X security even strongly suggests that "Users" not run in the "Administrator" account (the First one created). While NOT the Root account it still has many Superuser abilities.
Basic Mac OS X Security "Rule #1: The Administrator is Not for Daily Use
Contrary to what Apple does with the setup program, the administrator account is not viable for daily use. There are too many things this account can do that you don’t want a script to be able to, such as cleaning out /Applications or various folders within /Library."
An Introduction to Mac OS X Security "Simple Changes to Enhance the Security of Mac OS X
Once Mac OS X is installed, three quick steps will enhance your machine’s security:
* Create an additional, non-administrative account and use that for all of your day-to-day work. Using a non-administrative account will make it harder to damage your system because you won’t have the privileges to commit a serious mistake."
Macintosh OS X Security - Understanding the Platform and Usage "The most effective way to ensure that your Mac OS X system stays secure for months and years to come is to leave the root account alone. In current builds of Mac OS X, Apple has disabled root access to the system. Sure it can be hacked and then used for a login account however this is not recommended for the average user. Apple has designed the OS to allow a system administrator (user account created at install or given these rights by the original admin) to accomplish most tasks without needing to use the root account. Because the root account is the absolute power in a UNIX-based OS, this account can cause heavy damage to the system if it should happen to crash while logged in as root or can open up back doors simply by changing privileges on the system.
If trying to access remote sites while logged in as root such as www or ftp, this is an immediately hackable exploit. Remote users can “sniff†anything you do on your machine that is not encrypted. If logging as root, a hacker can access all files that that account can access- in this case, everything. Leaving the root account disabled will ensure that the system is not completely accessible by remote hackers.
Alternatively, opening the root account up for login access is even more dangerous as it allows the system to be setup for possible hack attempts by other users and could allow the destruction of important data should a system crash arrive. Only users who are absolutely sure what they are doing should ever log in as root, and then, when finished, should log off the system and back in as a regular user. "
I did NOT know that using Root account while surfing the web leaves you so open to Hacking - OR - a crash as the Root user could destroy protected Operating System files.
I WILL NEVER DO THAT AGAIN.
I don't suggest that others do it either!
A Security Primer for Mac OS X, part 3 "Do Not Enable the Root User
Since the root user is, according to the Unix permission scheme, all powerful, most attacks and exploits are targeted at it. Therefore, for security reasons, Apple has disabled it and only allows you to temporarily gain root privileges by entering your administrator password. "
Security in Mac OS X (.pdf file) "Root.
Mac OS X defines a superuser, named root, who has full permissions for access to all files on the system. ...
Unlike traditional UNIX systems, Mac OS X disables this powerful account by default.
This approach prevents viruses or unauthorized users from making harmful changes to the operating system."
NeoOffice is set by design to not be able to run as root. If you run it as root, you will see a message to that effect in the /Application/Utilities/Console application.
wow, this sux. not even an override commandline option?
If you feel it sux (sic), go pay for something that you feel doesn't.
That's what I really appreciate about free, open source software - we always have the choice.
<edit>Actually, because it is open source, there is nothing preventing you from coding this into the application yourself (or paying somebody to do it for you) and compiling your own personalised version.
That's what I really appreciate about free, open source software - we always have the choice.</edit> _________________ Ray Saunders
World Scout Bureau
wow, this sux. not even an override commandline option?
If you feel it sux (sic), go pay for something that you feel doesn't.
no offence, cool down.
also i don't know what this has to do with commercial vs. free soft.
Quote:
<edit>Actually, because it is open source, there is nothing preventing you from coding this into the application yourself (or paying somebody to do it for you) and compiling your own personalised version.
good grief, don't take it personal.
i just said that i don't like this one 'feature'.
wow, this sux. not even an override commandline option?
If you feel it sux (sic), go pay for something that you feel doesn't.
lol, or maybe just don't run as root since that both sux and blows. It's like walking down the main street of *Nixville with your pants down.
okay, okay, enough story telling.
i hear that a lot but can't second it. for a newbie of course but later?
i'm always using root but do su into restricted accounts for security reasons sometimes. if you're doing lots of administrative stuff it just sucks otherwise.
anyway i never got into any trouble in the last, well, 8 years or so ...
i have worked as a security consultant and on my machines i only use root.
i'm also doing much dev. and testing stuff so i have to eliminate as much as possible problem sources before i begin. so i'm absolutely not interested in working on a problem for half an hour to find out that it was just a rights issue i could have avoided.
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