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kervalen
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Joined: Nov 01, 2004
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 Posted: Wed Mar 09, 2005 6:23 pm Post subject: Option and control modifiers in keyboard shortcuts? |
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| There seems no way to assign keyboard shortcuts which use the option and control modifier keys. Have I missed something? |
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sardisson
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| Posted: Wed Mar 09, 2005 7:07 pm Post subject: |
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No. Option-keystroke/Opt-Shift-keystroke is reserved for keyboard entry (special characters and "composing" characters) on the Mac, and control is for contextual menus.
You can't use Cmd-Opt-keystroke/Cmd-Shift-Opt-keystroke because the OOo people have sat for two years on Ed's patch to enable a third modifier....
Smokey
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"[...] whether the duck drinks hot chocolate or coffee is irrelevant." -- ovvldc and sardisson in the NeoWiki |
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kervalen
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| Posted: Wed Mar 09, 2005 7:28 pm Post subject: |
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| sardisson wrote: | | No. Option-keystroke/Opt-Shift-keystroke is reserved for keyboard entry (special characters and "composing" characters) on the Mac, and control is for contextual menus. |
Ooops! You are quite right about the control key--I cover myself with ashes. However, the Apple HI Guidelines actually specify the use of option as a modifier with the arrow keys. Which is what brought this to my attention; option-left arrow (back a word) does not work.
Apple HI Guidelines on keyboard shortcuts:
http://developer.apple.com/documentation/UserExperience/Conceptual/OSXHIGuidelines/XHIGUserInput/chapter_2_section_3.html
See tables 1-1 and 1-2 for the material on the arrow keys. |
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bezvardis
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Joined: Dec 10, 2004
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Location: Latvia
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| Posted: Wed Mar 09, 2005 8:14 pm Post subject: |
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| It might be from another story but: recently all my preferences of NeoOffice disappeared (don't know the reason) and I had to rebuild them. among others I had a shortcut cmd-shift-w to open document properties. Now I try to recreate this shortcut but there seems not to be any possibility to do that. has there changed anything in the recent months or I am missing something here? |
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pluby
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bezvardis
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| Posted: Wed Mar 09, 2005 8:58 pm Post subject: |
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You are right! I reverted to previous test patch and got back my shortcuts. Thanks for advice! |
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sardisson
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| Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2005 12:27 am Post subject: |
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| kervalen wrote: | | However, the Apple HI Guidelines actually specify the use of option as a modifier with the arrow keys. Which is what brought this to my attention; option-left arrow (back a word) does not work. |
I did not know that; thanks! (In most cases I've seen before, either Windows converts or "cross-platform" software have wanted to assign Opt-(shift-)keystroke to menu-command functions, oblivious to their use on the Mac for character entry; as someone who's used that feature for many years...it makes me start jumping wildly).
In the case of the arrow keys + modifiers, it looks like OOo has assigned opt-left and opt-right's behavior to cmd-left and cmd-right.
Obviously for a full solution to this problem (AHIG compliance), we need the OOo engineers to 1) get with the program on Ed's patch 2) allow a wider selection of keystrokes and modifiers to be user-changed/assigned in the Tools>Configure>Keyboard dialogue and 3) audit keystroke assignments for platform HIG conformance. The likelihood of any of these happening while they still consider Mac OS X a second- or third-tier platfrom is low 
Smokey
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"[...] whether the duck drinks hot chocolate or coffee is irrelevant." -- ovvldc and sardisson in the NeoWiki |
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kervalen
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| Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2005 8:38 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | In the case of the arrow keys + modifiers, it looks like OOo has assigned opt-left and opt-right's behavior to cmd-left and cmd-right. |
Those are assigned to beginning of line/end of line by the HIG. I don't use them at all; I expect something different from them. Problem, of course, that the HIG assignments are used throughout the rest of the system, so I get all confused using NeoOffice.
Beyond the limitation on the number of modifiers (is this the patch, by the way?) is this something that could be addressed in NeoOffice/J itself? Or would it be preferable to devise a second dependent patch that provides the appropriate behavior in OOo itself? |
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sardisson
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| Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2005 5:52 pm Post subject: |
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| kervalen wrote: | | (is this the patch, by the way?) |
No, that's the patch that lets us use cmd instead of control in X11; some variation of it is likely already used in Neo/J. The patch is, not unexpectedly, missing from the OOo 2.0 build I tested (as are most, if not all, of the Mac-specific patches Ed and Dan and Patrick and Kevin wrote for OOo 1.0.x/1.1.x). Same old story.
The patch is Issue 11004.
| kervalen wrote: | | Beyond the limitation on the number of modifiers is this something that could be addressed in NeoOffice/J itself? Or would it be preferable to devise a second dependent patch that provides the appropriate behavior in OOo itself? |
The latter is "prefereable"--because it helps all of Mac OOo, and perhaps other platforms, too--if we're being good citizens in a community that doesn't really respect us. In reality, there are probably four people who could/would probably write such a patch, so you might file a bug in bugzilla and see if Patrick thinks it's something he can do given the time/financial constraints....
Smokey
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"[...] whether the duck drinks hot chocolate or coffee is irrelevant." -- ovvldc and sardisson in the NeoWiki |
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kervalen
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| Posted: Thu Mar 10, 2005 6:37 pm Post subject: |
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I don't see any reason to give the openoffice.org people more opportunities to ignore suggestions from the Mac side; beyond a certain point "good citizenship" is just an exercise in frustration. File the suggestions and then solve the problems.
Patrick, of course, has previously commented in this thread. Patrick? What do you think? |
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