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trinity.neooffice.org :: View topic - Insert special character seems a bit slow
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Insert special character seems a bit slow
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ovvldc
Captain Naiobi


Joined: Sep 13, 2004
Posts: 2349
Location: Zürich, CH

PostPosted: Fri Sep 14, 2012 2:46 am    Post subject: Insert special character seems a bit slow Reply with quote

I am wondering: if I first select 'insert special character', the window appears but can take up to 20 seconds to get any content. Then moving to a different subset in the same typeface also gets long delay. This gets better after something has been cached, when there is a only a brief one-second hiccup or so.

Is this because the fonts are so huge that they need so much time to process? Or is there something else?

Also, I noticed that when I select a different font, the subset gets put back to Latin - basic, even if what is shown is still the subset that I was previously looking at.

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pluby
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Joined: Jun 16, 2003
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 14, 2012 6:46 am    Post subject: Re: Insert special character seems a bit slow Reply with quote

ovvldc wrote:
I am wondering: if I first select 'insert special character', the window appears but can take up to 20 seconds to get any content. Then moving to a different subset in the same typeface also gets long delay. This gets better after something has been cached, when there is a only a brief one-second hiccup or so.


I cannot reproduce this. Selecting the Insert :: Special Character menu appears with full content in less than a second for me on my Mac OS X 10.7.

ovvldc wrote:
Is this because the fonts are so huge that they need so much time to process? Or is there something else?


I don't know. Sounds like a littled memory or CPU available problem. To check that, launch the /Applications/Utilities/Activity Monitor application to see if any applications are consistent using more than 1% CPU or a high amount of memory. Quit those apps and after a minute or so, does selecting the Insert :: Special Character menu open faster?

ovvldc wrote:
Also, I noticed that when I select a different font, the subset gets put back to Latin - basic, even if what is shown is still the subset that I was previously looking at.


I cannot reproduce this behavior either. I changed both the font name and subset, pressed OK, and when I selected the Insert :: Special Character menu, that same font and subset were selected.

Patrick

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amayze
The Merovingian


Joined: Oct 24, 2005
Posts: 534
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 14, 2012 7:43 am    Post subject: Re: Insert special character seems a bit slow Reply with quote

pluby wrote:

I cannot reproduce this behavior either. I changed both the font name and subset, pressed OK, and when I selected the Insert :: Special Character menu, that same font and subset were selected.

I don't think that's quite the right steps.
Try:

- Select Insert :: Special Character
- Change the Subset to something other than Basic Latin
- Wait for the characters in the grid to update in the window below
- Change the Font to something different
- The character grid is updated with the Font using the Subset that you selected above, however the Subset menu now shows Basic Latin

Is that clear? Hope so.

Andy
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pluby
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 14, 2012 7:49 am    Post subject: Re: Insert special character seems a bit slow Reply with quote

amayze wrote:
- Select Insert :: Special Character
- Change the Subset to something other than Basic Latin
- Wait for the characters in the grid to update in the window below
- Change the Font to something different
- The character grid is updated with the Font using the Subset that you selected above, however the Subset menu now shows Basic Latin


I can now reproduce what you see. The same behavior occurs in all versions of OpenOffice.org and LibreOffice so it is apparently the normal behavior for NeoOffice's underlying OpenOffice.org code.

Patrick

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ovvldc
Captain Naiobi


Joined: Sep 13, 2004
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 14, 2012 7:51 am    Post subject: Re: Insert special character seems a bit slow Reply with quote

pluby wrote:

I cannot reproduce this. Selecting the Insert :: Special Character menu appears with full content in less than a second for me on my Mac OS X 10.7.


And, of course, now that I tried to capture it, the window filled up much faster. What I did notice is that fontd had a spike in activity. With 4GB in my machine, I doubt that memory was the issue.

I'll get back if and when I can reproduce this reliably.

Quote:
I cannot reproduce this behavior either. I changed both the font name and subset, pressed OK, and when I selected the Insert :: Special Character menu, that same font and subset were selected.


You might be looking at the wrong thing:

1. Open a new Writer document
2. Open Insert::Special Character
3. Select a different subset (greek or something)
4. Change the typeface
Characters shown stay the same, subset name in the window reverts.

The attached screenshots show the difference in the Special Character selection window before and after step 4.

I hope this helps. It isn't a big deal, just a cosmetic error.

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pluby
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 14, 2012 7:53 am    Post subject: Re: Insert special character seems a bit slow Reply with quote

ovvldc wrote:
1. Open a new Writer document
2. Open Insert::Special Character
3. Select a different subset (greek or something)
4. Change the typeface
Characters shown stay the same, subset name in the window reverts.


I can now reproduce what you see. The same behavior occurs in all versions of OpenOffice.org and LibreOffice so it is apparently the normal behavior for NeoOffice's underlying OpenOffice.org code when you change the font name: the subset is reset to the default.

Patrick

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ovvldc
Captain Naiobi


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 14, 2012 8:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, it is inconsistent with what is actually shown, but maybe there's a reason why this is the way it is organised..
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sardisson
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 14, 2012 1:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That seems like pretty unhelpful behavior (I'd go so far as to call it a bug!); I wonder if it might be worth one of us filing a bug in LibreOffice's bug tracker?

Smokey

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pluby
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 14, 2012 4:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sardisson wrote:
That seems like pretty unhelpful behavior (I'd go so far as to call it a bug!); I wonder if it might be worth one of us filing a bug in LibreOffice's bug tracker?


Go ahead, but since this behavior has been normal behavior in every version of NeoOffice released in the last 10 years, changing this behavior is definitely not within the scope of the NeoOffice project.

The scope of the NeoOffice project has not changed and is still limited to keeping a stable version of OpenOffice.org running on the most recent Mac OS X versions and fixing OpenOffice.org feature bugs fall outside that scope.

Note that preparing NeoOffice for the Mac OS X app sandbox will likely consume all of our development time in the coming year so only critical or crashing bugs will be fixed so no optimization or tweaking of the OpenOffice.org user interface behaviors will be considered.

Patrick

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sardisson
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 14, 2012 8:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pluby wrote:
sardisson wrote:
That seems like pretty unhelpful behavior (I'd go so far as to call it a bug!); I wonder if it might be worth one of us filing a bug in LibreOffice's bug tracker?


Go ahead, but since this behavior has been normal behavior in every version of NeoOffice released in the last 10 years, changing this behavior is definitely not within the scope of the NeoOffice project.

Right, it's clearly an OpenOffice.org/LibreOffice issue to fix, not a NeoOffice one, and I wasn't trying to imply or suggest it get fixed in NeoOffice instead of fixed upstream.

I guess a better way of stating my question is, "Does anyone have any experience with filing LibreOffice bugs that would indicate doing so is less of a waste of time than filing OpenOffice.org bugs was/is? If someone files a bug, are they likely to fix it in our lifetimes?" Especially, as Patrick noted, this ridiculous behavior has been the default for the last 10 years (I admit that I also thought it used to work differently)… OOo in the last 10 years has never fixed a single bug I've filed, so I gave up wasting my time years ago (by contrast, Patrick has fixed 100s of crashes, hangs, and NeoOffice-specific broken behaviors I've reported in that time period).

Edit: Oh, I also misunderstood what Oscar reported; I thought he was reporting the *character grid* reverted to the Basic Latin glyph range (which would indeed be very unhelpful), not that only the *name in Subset pop-up menu* reverted to Basic Latin. So *much less* of an issue.

At any rate, do we know if LibO is likely to fix bugs reported to them? If so, it might still be worth one of us reporting this one to them. Otherwise, given what the bug actually is, it's not worth one of us wasting our time and everyone will continue to just live with it…

Smokey

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pluby
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 17, 2012 3:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sardisson wrote:
At any rate, do we know if LibO is likely to fix bugs reported to them? If so, it might still be worth one of us reporting this one to them. Otherwise, given what the bug actually is, it's not worth one of us wasting our time and everyone will continue to just live with it…


I don't know how LibreOffice engineers prioritize bugs, but IIRC Novell (or maybe now SUSE) and RedHat fund around 10 or so LibreOffice engineers. That is a small fraction of the number of OpenOffice.org engineers Sun and Oracle funded so I think it is reasonable to assume there are a lot less engineers available and so I wouldn't be surprised if they are only able to fix bugs that cause significant problems. Additionally, I wouldn't be surprised if there is a lot of pressure to fix bugs reported by customers of the companies that are funding these engineers first.

Patrick

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